The tactics are laughable

The tactics/system are definitely a big part of why the defence is so leaky. How can it not be? It's a largely changed defence to last year's, with Vicario new, Udogie new, VDV new, no Dier or Sanchez anymore, Porro was in the team last season but only since February. So it's largely changed from the team last season that conceded the most goals since the PL's inception, and yet we're in danger of conceding just as many, with defenders who we consider to be good and who have mainly received praise this season.

I mean Davies isn't good enough for these types of games and that is the danger of settling for substandard players as squad players, but you do have to concede that these continual gifted chances to the opposition are occurring under Ange and the way we play.

comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think only Sheff Utd have conceded more goals than us…

The amount we concede is an utter disgrace… we have Romero & VDV… who are world class… but we still concede far too many goals…

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They are NOT world class , just two decent CB's.

How can you not say Romero is NOT world class… hes just won the World Cup with Argentina ffs… that makes him world class…VDV & Romero,would get into any side in the Premier League or Europe… they’re wasted in this system we play!!

comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think only Sheff Utd have conceded more goals than us…

The amount we concede is an utter disgrace… we have Romero & VDV… who are world class… but we still concede far too many goals…

----------------------------------------------------------------------
They are NOT world class , just two decent CB's.

How can you not say Romero is NOT world class… hes just won the World Cup with Argentina ffs… that makes him world class…VDV & Romero,would get into any side in the Premier League or Europe… they’re wasted in this system we play!!
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I say it because it's the truth, Argetina didn't win it because of Romero's world class defending, they played with 10 men behind the ball and passed to Messi....Romero would not get into any PL side either, maybe in the squad but not in none of the top 4 sides....maybe Villa, but that's it.

comment by Mack (U6574)
posted 18 minutes ago
comment by Devonshirespur (U6316)
posted 45 minutes ago
comment by fridgeboy (U1053)
posted 19 minutes ago
I agree that it's a tactical issue and not necessarily a personnel one, although better players would be able to fit better, but I don't think you're right saying it's all about the defence. It's about the forward and midfield players doing their job to not allow the time and space for the opposition player making that pass. Too many times they're allowed to get their head up and pick out that space in behind. Pressure on the ball means our defence wouldn't be as burdened. I think we've stopped pressing as well as we once did.

Where I think this system is flawed is that usually when you play a high line, if your forward players do press then opposition players find it hard to pick out a pass in behind. The problem we have is that there's so much space, any long pass doesn't really need to be accurate as long as it somewhere down those flanks. Basically if a ball is played over the top and VDV isn't the first to it, we're bang in trouble, every single time. It's definitely an issue that needs tweaking.

I just don't think it's wise to send both full backs into midfield at the same time. No one else does it in this league probably because it's known to be suicide. If Porro goes forward, Udogie should sit on the defensive line and vice-versa. That allows the defence to cover more space and not get done on the turnover every time. I'm amazed Ange hasn't tweaked that yet.
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I agree more or less with you. The tactics are not wildly different to how most top teams set up. At times we have both FBs forward but not always. Davies was back, tracking Saka for his goal. Last time vs NUFC, Udogie was back with Gordon but allowed him to get the better of him when they scored on teh counter. Both individual moments.

I totally agree with you on the final third and midfield press. Its not intense enough and out balls are easily found....even fouling on the edge of the opponents area is an opportunity we do not take. Our play is broken up so many times by 'nothing fouls' that get no yellow. We need to do more of this.

If you look up to the build up to Sakas goal, then when they break our defence is feeding back but no one presses the ball player. Porro runs past Havertz to recover his position but should press him. Romero is tracking Trossards run ((RB position) VDV is central (CB) and Davies tracking Saka but is probably too central and too close to VDV. So he has left acres for Saka and has to cover a lot of ground to close him down and is then easily 'sent' when Saka cuts back.

Also in the very early stages on that break, PEH is with Saka and Saka plays the ball wide to Havertz. Still 20+ yards inside their own half. Saka plays and then gets moving. PEH jogs. Doesnt attempt to track Saka and then also lets Odegaard jog passed him. If Saka had be held up by Davies,then he has Odegaard running unmarked into the box to pass to.

I can accept our 'open' tactics, but to deny that it is not individual errors that contribute to this approach not working well misses a big part of our current problems. These players are not working hard enough or making the right decisions.

In that instance, poor decision making from Porrro gives them time and space.

Poor positioning and awareness from Davies gives Saka time and space.

School boy defensive play from Davies allows Saka on to his left.

PEH has let Odegaard run passed him so ever if its saved or Saka gets his head up he has an easy pass to an unmarked midfielder.






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Agree with most of this. What you are highlighting is that players like Davies and hjolberg have no business playing in the system.

Questions on the same level over bents, Biss, Kulu.

Midfield is where we are losing these games. Ange can’t find a solution to it, as you have seen with so many changes.

The solution is we need three or four first team players. Not squad players or young club signings. Proper quality.

Like them signing rice. That’s what we need to do.

Trossard was excellent for them yesterday. We nearly signed him but bulked at the price.

We have to show some ambition this summer or ange will be gone this time next year.
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I think you are over simplifying it.

I would agree that the likes of Hojbjerg and Davies are not well suited but Bentancur certainly has the ability and skill set, as does Bissouma...i think the midfield is looking a bit lost.

Deki isnt really part of the problem, defensively. For me its the positioning of players the moment the move breaks down and there's a turn over. In that moment, currently there is little structure or organised positioning

comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 20 minutes ago
comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 7 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think only Sheff Utd have conceded more goals than us…

The amount we concede is an utter disgrace… we have Romero & VDV… who are world class… but we still concede far too many goals…

----------------------------------------------------------------------
They are NOT world class , just two decent CB's.

How can you not say Romero is NOT world class… hes just won the World Cup with Argentina ffs… that makes him world class…VDV & Romero,would get into any side in the Premier League or Europe… they’re wasted in this system we play!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I say it because it's the truth, Argetina didn't win it because of Romero's world class defending, they played with 10 men behind the ball and passed to Messi....Romero would not get into any PL side either, maybe in the squad but not in none of the top 4 sides....maybe Villa, but that's it.
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You are one very deluded gooner.

Another thing that needs discussing is our attack. Its looked toothless recently. Yesterday, apart from Son’s shot from Porro’s ball over the top (on a rare occasion Arsenal weren’t in a low block), I can’t think of a single opportunity or chance we created in open play. The amount of weak, floater crosses into Raya’s arms were painful.

So what is the point of all out attack if we don’t look dangerous?

Every top team in the league concedes that type of chance.

Its the payoff that teams have to compensate for scoring goals and breaking down defences.

You have to rely on the individual to not get beaten 1v1/1v2.

A more relevant point would be regarding if you thought the pressure on Havertz was suffice.

Under Poch our high line was even higher & it worked.

"If you look up to the build up to Sakas goal, then when they break our defence is feeding back but no one presses the ball player. Porro runs past Havertz to recover his position but should press him. Romero is tracking Trossards run ((RB position) VDV is central (CB) and Davies tracking Saka but is probably too central and too close to VDV. So he has left acres for Saka and has to cover a lot of ground to close him down and is then easily 'sent' when Saka cuts back.

Also in the very early stages on that break, PEH is with Saka and Saka plays the ball wide to Havertz. Still 20+ yards inside their own half. Saka plays and then gets moving. PEH jogs. Doesnt attempt to track Saka and then also lets Odegaard jog passed him. If Saka had be held up by Davies,then he has Odegaard running unmarked into the box to pass to.

I can accept our 'open' tactics, but to deny that it is not individual errors that contribute to this approach not working well misses a big part of our current problems. These players are not working hard enough or making the right decisions.

In that instance, poor decision making from Porrro gives them time and space.

Poor positioning and awareness from Davies gives Saka time and space.

School boy defensive play from Davies allows Saka on to his left.

PEH has let Odegaard run passed him so ever if its saved or Saka gets his head up he has an easy pass to an unmarked midfielder."


This was a good breakdown Devon.

comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 1 hour, 41 minutes ago
comment by AFCISMYTEAM (U14931)
posted 5 minutes ago
comment by Conn & Duncan..Scottish Legends (U15636)
posted 6 minutes ago
I think only Sheff Utd have conceded more goals than us…

The amount we concede is an utter disgrace… we have Romero & VDV… who are world class… but we still concede far too many goals…

----------------------------------------------------------------------
They are NOT world class , just two decent CB's.

How can you not say Romero is NOT world class… hes just won the World Cup with Argentina ffs… that makes him world class…VDV & Romero,would get into any side in the Premier League or Europe… they’re wasted in this system we play!!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I do think it's mad that you had two weeks off, before playing against the team with the best set piece record in the league and you came out and set up for corners like you did.

Seems like really amateur, almost arrogant stuff.